I've just been looking through the 'teacher nightmares' section on ajarn.com. Let's put things into perspective here. Thailand remains one of the few countries where foreigners with very few qualifications, and in quite a few cases no qualifications at all, are able to land full-time teaching positions within the mainstream system. I mean, what do people expect? With such low requirements the country is hardly likely to be a world leader in the field of education,is it? If it was, then things would be rather different and 95% of the farangs currently working here wouldn't be able to do so. We shouldn't forget how lucky we are. A 4-week intensive course and hey presto - you are now a qualified English teacher. Many Thai teachers are committed professionals with qualifications coming out their ears and yet they still have to accept the fact that they are going to earn a fraction of what the the TEFL course qualified farang is getting.

Having said this, The stories like the ones on here and others that you hear on the grapevine still never cease to amaze me. It also continues to shock me at just how short sighted, unrealistic and naive some schools can be. I recently saw an advertisement for a position in an 'International school'. They needed somebody who was fully qualified to teach GCSEs, in other words, someone with QTS. They were offering the princely sum of 33K per month. I mean, who are they trying to kid?! Dream on! I have no doubt that they will end up employing someone with a BA (if they are very lucky) and a 4-week TEFL course certificate that was obtained from a language school on a beach somewhere down in the Islands.

There is no doubt that Thailand is behind, way behind. But the fault lies with the system and the people who run the schools. I'm sorry, but you try putting 55 kids of ANY nationality in a small room all day long - you are going to have problems. Many of the kids that you meet here are wonderful, bright, highly respectful and intelligent young people who are simply being stifled in their current environment. It is a great shame. For me the worst part is just the general acceptance of the situation -the 'that's just the way it is" attitude. Of course, the general population don't know any better, and having 55 mixed ability teens in the classroom of a 'top, private school' is perfectly normal.

I work for a government English program in Bangkok nowhere near the flooded areas. We were originally supposed to begin the term tomorrow, but it has now been delayed by two weeks to November 15th. I've been told that all government schools in Bangkok have been ordered to delay by two weeks. I was surprised to see no discussion here. Are all you Bangkok teachers in similar situations? Also, we've been told that we will have to make up the time by working Saturdays! Won't this violate the rumored "20 hours max per week" rule?

Ajarn Forum Member

I want to share my story with you. A little background first. From 1999-2007 I visited Thailand a dozen times. Of course on vacation things are great, the sabai sabai attitude is perfect for a holiday. I decided to move to Thailand to take a break from the USA, and before I moved I paid off all my debts and saved as much as I could for the time I would want to move back to America. Yes I think it's important to have a back-up plan.

I found moving to Bangkok easy. I found a job working at a government school, which was a good deal because they did not hold us all day - just work the hours you teach and then go home, so often I was out by early afternoon. This enabled me to do an evening job and earn a decent monthly income. I also had a nice apartment in a convenient neighborhood.

But things in Thailand changed, I noticed it right away. People weren't as nice as before. People were upset with the Taksin thing, the yellow shirts at the airport, the whole government in general. I also think people were seeing the income differences more then before. I could feel it everywhere. I needed out only after 4 years. I have returned to USA. Yes I miss the Thai food, I miss my free time, and I miss my trips to the beach. But I can visit often and coming here for just a vacation is better. I think things will get worse and worse until they can address the income differences. I hope for Thailand people, I really do.

Sean

After over seven years of teaching in Thailand I’m leaving for Saudi Arabia. First, let me say that for the seven years I have been here, the first five were excellent, but I have seen a drastic change for the worse over the past two years. I have met a lot of good people here, Thais and Foreigners alike that I wouldn’t have had the opportunity in meeting back home in Wales. Albeit, I feel now is the time for a change and fresh start elsewhere. I have worked at various institutions since coming here in 2004. I have worked in government schools, a university, an international school and various language centres across the country. I had the privilege of working with Mr. Russell Park, a teacher who has worked- his shocks off at becoming a better teacher he is also someone who genuinely cares about his students.

The main reason for me leaving is obviously the money. Since coming here the salaries haven’t increased, in fact over the last few years I have seen a decrease in the salaries being offered. When I first arrived in Thailand it was the biggest culture shock known to mankind. The Thais working at the local shops, restaurants and other establishments actually smiled at me and fell over backwards to assist in any way possible. I had never experienced anything like that back home in Wales. Unfortunately, in my opinion, over the last few years I have seen people’s attitudes change for the worse, now I get “What you want?” Not have” (when you know damn well they have) or even to the point of being totally ignored.

Also, I have seen the change in attitude form the majority of the Thai teaching staff, particularly in the Government schools, towards the foreign teachers. I often used to ask myself, “Do they want us here”? The conclusion I came to was, “NO”. I will leave Thailand with mixed emotions. I will be taking with me a lot of fond and amusing memories, but I have to say also a lot of bitter and hopefully forgettable memories. I shall miss Thailand the place I have called home for seven years, also I will miss my friends and colleagues, but I hope to return one day, that is if the Thai government will stop scamming money out of us!
Good luck to you all, and don’t let the buggers get you down.

Keith Evans

In reply to 'Thailand you have lost another good teacher' (Postbox 7th October) the noble concept of bettering students and a country is no small matter. Thailand has a lot to offer its students and in a sense it is better than many of the other "developing nations". However, with systems and policies in relation to the way foreign teachers are treated, it results in a mix between the dark ages and the 21st century.

People and cultures are judged on the way they treat outsiders and animals. Unfortunately, animals are often treated a bit better than foreign teachers. I am quite surprised to notice that after a long time, it is now starting to backfire. The numbers of new foreign teachers are not as many as before - just like the tourists. Before, Thailand had a place in the ESL world that was a lot less lucrative for teachers than South Korea, but it was 'sabai sabai' and an element of real smiles. Now, it is hard to find a smile from Thai employers and even harder to try and smile as a foreign teacher.

Like any profession, market forces take priority. Where Thailand had a niche, China has now opened its doors and is offering a lot more. If Thailand wants to still remain a player in this game, it is time for a 100% top to bottom change. Change requires the Thais to rethink very deep points:

1. Is the foreigner actually the devil and therefore not welcome in Thailand?
2. Of all the countless foreign teachers that have given their sweat and blood for Thai students - just like the foreigners did during the second world war. Bridge over the River Kwai (Kanchanaburi) and a lot more. We built the railways and the EP school programs (modern times) Anybody want to say thanks?

If the foreigner is not unwanted, then it is time for the penny to drop, and if we are really included (as opposed to excluded from everything) maybe we can all work together to build a really good tomorrow for both Thais and foreigners and especially the students! I have met, lived and worked with numerous people from numerous nations - the biggest obstacle for progress is an artificial divide - us and them.

Phil says - I really don't get the second point. Weren't soldiers forced to build the Bridge over The River Kwai? But no one forces anyone to come here and teach English. And to come up with statements such as "there aren't as many foreign teachers as before', you need to have access to statistics or data. And data on foreign teachers doesn't exist. It never has,

Mr Grumpy

Because of the way Thailand has changed over the past few years. Because of their attitude towards foreign teachers and tourists in general, their country is witnessing the lowest tourist numbers in modern times. All the major cities and tourist destinations are empty. And the truth is, they have brought it all on themselves. I personally have lived here for three years now and have taught at schools for the same amount of time.

The salary I receive is about right for me. Basically because I feel I'm still learning how to teach, yes I am a TEFL teacher not a "real" teacher. When I first came here to start teaching, I was very very fortunate to become friends with two extremely professional and dedicated teachers, Keith and Dale. They were both employed by a university, where they had taught for 5 years. I think I'm right in saying this is their 8th year teaching in Thailand. They have both learnt the Thai language and Keith has even learnt to speak Issan. My thanks goes to these two teachers who taught me how to teach. I have tried to make a career teaching here and a new way of life. I worked with Kieth for over a year and witnessed a truly excellent TEFL teacher at work. I would sit in his classes at every opportunity, just watching and learning.

And now because of the way this country is turning with disrespectful Thai teachers and the ever increasing red tape, Keith is leaving Thailand and Dale is seriously having the same thoughts. It strikes me that Thais wont be happy until the last "farang" as they call us leave this country. And if you're one of those farang that can't see the wood for the trees, please leave your stupid responses for someone else.

Thailand you have just lost a very good teacher and maybe another one very soon. It makes me angry when good people like that, who have made the effort to live and educate children for so long in a third world country like this are left with no option but to leave because of bad pay and bad manners.

Mr. Russell Park

Another perspective on the qualified versus unqualified teachers debate might be to say the following. What prevails is not the truth, but instead the viewpoint of the majority. Or, the viewpoint of those in power. Any foreigner living in Thailand should gladly recognise that by now.

For example, in times where the majority of Western teachers were monocultural and monolingual – able to speak but English, and unfamiliar with other cultures in all but the most shallow of senses – native languages were thought to have no place in the second language classroom. Which, unless you have a terminal case of having your head stuck in the sand, or have not opened a book on teaching in the last 20 years, is a philosophy that in the present day has well and truly been debunked. More to the point, if you can actually speak another language, you can easily see how advantageous a prudent use of the native language in the classroom might be – for example, to clarify instructions regarding the steps to follow in very complex language activities, wherein it is the target use of the language that is important, and not the three hours it would take to get the students to properly understand what they should be doing by miming and shouting. Or, to explain a complex concept, where it is the concept that is important and not the language that describes it, again for the purposes of saving time and sticking to the curriculum. Only someone who cannot speak the native language, that is, would be able to overlook these advantages, and say that in fact there are none.

Yet, this idea possessed a lot of currency, and is still dogmatically adhered to by some. Part of the momentum for this ‘religion’, it would be distinctly uncritical not to note, must surely derive from the facts that (1) if being able to speak the native language, all other things being equal, is advantageous, then it reflects badly on one not to be able to speak it, which does not ride well with the cultural profile of your typical monolingual, monocultural person; and (2) the fact that the majority of its supporters (the upholders of this faith) were in the same boat, and that they were thus able to manufacture ‘truth’ collectively.

To put it simply, if you take a hundred people, ten of whom can speak another language, and ask them what the role of native languages are in the classroom, the chances are that the ultimate consensus is going to be that there is very little good about it. Reason has nothing to do with it, this is a very convenient truth for most of these people to cling to.

Another good example is the issue of qualifications versus experience. In the past, people could get a teacher’s license in a couple of years, by studying a pre-information age diploma. Now, teachers have to do a four or five year degree in order to become qualified. In the Middle East, for example, where older teachers dominate, experience is upheld as the signifying quality of a sound teacher. In South Korea, where younger teachers prevail, it is characteristics like education, place of education, second language ability, number of publications and familiarity with new technologies that are held in the highest esteem.

As to where the truth lies in this debate, I am not going to stick my toe in – other, that is, than to observe that when I used to teach at university in Thailand, the most unmanageable students were the older Thai teachers, they had far less academic integrity than the younger generations. They cheated rampantly in their exams; they were the most prone to have a sleep in the class and not do their homework; and they used to force the younger teachers to give them their completed homework, so they could pass it off as their own. 'No bull', as the Australians say, they were the people I would be least inclined to look up to as an example.

So then we get to the issue of qualifications in general. If we want to know what ideas prevail in Thailand, we could have a look at the teacher demography. Wow, there are a lot of unqualified teachers practising…the prime movers in Thai schools, who do not have any concept of what constitutes a decent education, like unqualified teachers because they are cheap, and because their views around teaching correspond…in this context, we might expect to find the view that unqualified teachers are good teachers. Or, that teaching is not a proper profession in the respect that one does not have to possess any specialist knowledge or skills.

Do such views prevail? Where might they prevail? I will leave it to the reader to ponder these things themselves...

Chris

With all these letters re qualified vs unqualified teachers, let me state that after teaching in excess of forty years here, three of the best teachers I have ever listened to are 'unqualified' but great teachers. They prepare well, teach where the students are and try to lift the bar and stretch the students. Their qualifications were earned on the front line. I have a degree but they are better teachers than I. I believe most of the frustration that foreign teachers face is caused by the poor quality of 'education' (if you can call it that) in government schools. I have taught in both systems and the lack of funds and poor standards (copying, pretty pictures etc) in government schools condemn students in this system to a second rate teaching experience, degree or no degree.

Michael Holdcroft

I've been teaching in Thailand for seven years and I've been an avid reader of the "ajarn.com's various articles since 2006". Like most of my fellow foreign teachers here I've been through the visa and work permit mangle and all the other bureaucratic crap that the Thai Government can throw at a human being, but here I remain. I originate from Wales and I'm proud of that fact, but as most of us know, The UK, The USA, Australia, etc have all changed for the worse. So, the million dollar question is, what keeps us in Thailand?

Let's face the facts. It's not the salaries ...they have remained the same for many years. Some will say "job satisfaction", that was true several years ago, when in my opinion, the students and the Thai-teaching staff showed respect towards the hard working foreign staff at their schools. Nowadays, some students and also the Thai teachers show us nothing but contempt and on some occasions pure hatred. I've read several articles written by teachers who have had horrific experiences regarding teaching agencies and co-teachers. And of course there is the visa and work permit saga, and believe me when I say I've experienced most of the above myself. I would be interested to read the responses to my original question. What keeps us in Thailand?

Keith Evans

Putting the Bangkok bubble aside. do you think that the speed the Thai education system is moving is too fast? In 2010 there were 250 schools nationwide in the EP program. In 2011 it doubled to 500 and they estimate it will double again next year. The Thais are running around the country, awarding their schools this stamp of 'World Class School'. Which world do they mean? There are putting students into English-taught science, mathematics, computer lessons amongst other topics. Having worked at a few different, world class schools, as just an English teacher, the levels of actual English speaking and more important, understanding what they are saying, isn't the best in the Asean group of countries. After speaking to many foreign teachers of science, maths etc, they always say the same thing, it's a joke.

Yes, of course, schools should teach those subjects and pupils need to learn them. But put yourself in a Thai lesson on the same subjects, if your basic Thai is anything like mine. It would blow your mind. There is a reason for their speedy propulsion into these subjects. In 2015 the Asean is coming together as one, similar to our Europe. God help them!. And Thailand is so far behind most of the other member countries, in terms of education and levels of English. They have been given no choice, but to step it up. And in the great traditional way of life here, If it looks ok, it is ok.

Mr. Russell Park